Kortney - Pumping on a Teacher's Schedule

Transcript 

Speaker 1 

Hello and welcome to spilling the milk. This is the podcast where we talk about what it's really like to breastfeed a baby, and we leave space for moms to share their breastfeeding journey and maybe process things that they haven't even had a chance to yet. My guest today is Courtney. We met in a professional networking group because she has recently transitioned from being a full time classroom teacher and band director to a freelance instructional designer. A career path that is near and dear to my heart. Courtney and I have lots in common. We could probably talk for hours. But in our conversation today, we did focus on her breastfeeding journey and specifically what that looked like once she returned to teaching at school and wanting to still pump and provide some breast milk for her babies. Please enjoy my conversation with Courtney. So you're familiar with the podcast? It's pretty much, you know, giving space for moms to share about their own best experience. And it seems like everyone has like a. Unique story to tell. So if you want to just start by, maybe introducing yourself telling us about your your child and. And you mentioned you know that you could speak to the teacher experience, which is really cool. So yeah, we're introducing. Tell us a little bit about about you. 

Speaker 2 

OK, sure. So of. And I just left teaching in January of this year. So I haven't been out of the classroom for very long. Now I'm working from home as an instructional designer. I have two little. Kids and one of them I. Was a part of the two under 2 club. For about 3 weeks. So my son just turned. Three, and my daughter just turned a year old just in the last couple of months. So breastfeeding them my son was a struggle challenged kind of the whole time had mastitis like. Three or four times at least. He was born just a couple of like, days before COVID NIT the country. 

Speaker 

So we were dealing with. 

Speaker 2 

It all in lockdown, you know. So then when my daughter came around, was. Like if we have to use formula we will. But I'm going to try it and it was. Just a totally different experience like. Breastfeeding her was so easy. And it was a breeze. The whole. Time, so I don't. Know why he was so complicated, but he was. 

Speaker 1 

That's interesting. 

Speaker 2 

So I guess that just kind of goes to show that even like with the same mom, each kid has a totally different experience. 

Speaker 1 

Well, and you are part of a very unique group of people. I think. I know you're like my third person that I know personally who had their baby like, right before COVID or, you know. Like you know. I think you guys have had like a pretty unique experience because you have like the added stress of the isolation and then not being able to reach out for help. As much as most people usually can. 

Speaker 2 

Yeah, that was kind of crazy. So I was lucky that my mom came and stayed with us the first week, so I guess he was born about a week or two before everything. Like, really got crazy. So she was here for that first week. My grandparents both got to come and meet him before everything. Like, really. You know, shut down. But then they didn't see him. Again, until he was. Like five or six months old. And we were, you know, dealing with it all. Just me and my husband. So yeah that. Was a lot. 

Speaker 1 

It is a lot. And so you mentioned mastitis like I guess what other challenges? So did you. End up switching the formula with him. 

Speaker 2 

So we kind of did a little bit of both. I actually breasted him until he was eleven months old, but I did have my sites through a few times and. So when he first. We first started. He didn't have a. Great latch and I was using ****** Shields. And I think I used those a little bit too long and that's part of how I got mastitis the first time because it wasn't emptying all the way. Using the ****** Shields and then it was COVID when I got COVID like I didn't have COVID Nery badly, but it caused mastitis flare up. Like horrible, I hadn't dealt. With it in months. But I just suddenly had like 102 fever on Christmas Eve, of course. The Ware is. Open except from the emergency room on Christmas Eve. Yeah. So that was. That was fun. It was just really weird how having COVID seemed. To like. Cause my body to. 

Speaker 1 

I don't know. Like. 

Speaker 2 

It caused mastitis somehow. Which was really weird and that was the worst. Like symptom I had, I didn't really have. Any of the COVID symptoms? It just caused me to have. 

Speaker 1 

Really bad situs, which was how interesting. I wonder if other people had a similar experience. I mean again, it's. Like a very specific sub set. Of people. 

Speaker 

Yeah, yeah. 

Speaker 2 

And then like when I went back to teaching, so I was already planned to be out cuz he was born in February, so my maternity leave was already supposed to be through. This summer I had planned. It where I could take off until the next fall, but then of course over came around and shut down the. Schools anyways. So nobody returned until the fall, but when I went back, I knew that I didn't, really. Have the time in my schedule to pump every two or three hours like he would be eating, so we kind of weaned him down and started doing some formula as well during the day, so I still pumped when I went back to school but only like during lunch and eventually weaned myself off of pumping altogether because I just. Hated it. It was just not fun, so he did do formula quite a bit from like 6 to 12 months. He would just do formula. Here, just because that's what was easiest for us. 

Speaker 1 

But then. Yeah, well, and then so were you then nursing like morning and night. 

Speaker 2 

So I nursed him when we were together and just did formula when we weren't. And that worked out. For us. Just easier on me mentally than because I hate. It pumping so much. And I unfortunately didn't have very supportive administrators. That were willing to. Give me the time and my day that I needed to be able to do it the way I should so. I just cut it down so that I only had to pump once during the day and. That was mostly for myself to. Avoid that status. 

Speaker 

And that's a. And we just. 

Speaker 2 

Long time to go. We just kind of became at peace with. Doing formula at daycare and. That was what worked best for us. 

Speaker 1 

Yeah, it sounds like a nice balance and I. Do like that. You sort of illustrate the logistics of. How a baby that age might do sort of half and half? I mean thinking about teachers schedule, like you barely have time to pee today, let alone like a 20 minute plus pumping session. I don't know. Like do you have any teacher friends that have successfully pumped like multiple times a day in their schedule? 

Speaker 2 

So I haven't had very many. Who had to pump that word just because I worked with mostly like older people or people who decided not to pump? 

Speaker 

Right. 

Speaker 2 

They were just not breastfeeding at all, right? I managed to do it twice, so this with my daughter. Like I said, she was much easier. Just kind of all around. And I also discovered. The amazing like. Wearable pumps? Yeah, that was a life changer. 

Speaker 1 

Yeah, tell me that goes, that's. 

Speaker 2 

Yeah. So I can. 

Speaker 1 

New, I hear. I know. 

Speaker 2 

That I could sit at my desk and like, not have to worry. About somebody walking in on me. Or whatever cause it was all just inside. My bra. Yeah, and it was amazing. So I used that with my daughter at when I was at work and was able to. Actually pump 3. Usually three times a day, so I had my planning first thing in the morning and. I would pump. During that. And then during lunch. And then right after school. So I was a band director, so I had after school rehearsals a lot of days a. Week and with the wearable pumps, I could even if I managed to like get them in before the band kids got into the room while they were all like hanging out coming in and putting instruments together and stuff. They had no idea. I was even pumping because the room was so noisy they couldn't hear it anyways cuz. So I mean, I would just put those in and pump for like the 1st 15 minutes of band and then just. Take a little break. And dump them. Out and the kids had no idea. The ones that did figure it out were like, OK, cool she's making. Milk for her daughter. You know, they didn't make a. Big deal out of. It so the wearable pump was really a life. 

Speaker 

It's like. 

Speaker 2 

Changer with the pumping at work. 

Speaker 1 

Yeah, that makes sense and I mean. Honestly, it's kind of like you're normalizing it for them. Like I hope the next generation is a little bit more. Normalized like that. 

Speaker 2 

Yeah. So I had four practice rooms in my band room, and one of them during that whole season of life was Mama Ross's room. And so that was where my like I had a mini fridge in there and that's. Where all my. Pump parts would. Be after I like washed them and I'd leave. Leave them out to dry and. So they all knew what it. Was and what I was doing and. I mean, I was teaching middle and high school, so you. Know most of them weren't totally weirded out by it. Yeah, but that so that it's sort of a. 

Speaker 1 

Special case that. Since you have that, we're like most like. 

Speaker 2 

Right, I have. 

Speaker 1 

If you have dreaming. You that extra. 

Speaker 2 

I have my own room. Yeah, yeah. So I think a lot of teachers struggle because. They don't have the space to do it, you know they don't have a good place to go and people are always walking in on them in their classroom, even over the cow signs. You hang over the lot. People still let themselves in like I've seen a lot. Of struggles with that and different. 

Speaker 

One moment. 

Speaker 2 

Mom grouped them apart of. So yeah, I was kind. Of lucky to have. That separate room within my room. That I could go to. 

Speaker 1 

You mentioned mom groups that you're part of. Is that something online or in person, or what's the? 

Speaker 2 

Yeah, in Facebook. So generation lactation is one that I'm on in Facebook and. They have a lot of really great like. Breastfeeding advice and just kind of celebrations. They have these little graphics you can share when you've made it. To a certain. You know, I made it a month I made. It six months I made it. 3 mastitis or whatever. So. It's kind of a fun little. Like just community, if specifically people who are breastfeeding. And it's ran. By a couple of. Lactation specialists. And then I was also part of a music teacher, Momma's group on Facebook that, you know, we could kind of gripe about. The specific. Problems with music teaching and you know, like I had to go to all day Saturday band competitions right? And like pumping on the bus and trying. To figure out. Where to pump at the competition and how to get away from kids? And so there's a lot of, like, logistics there that I would talk through with other music. Teach your moms like how? Have you done this? How do you store breast milk? For 12 hours a day, when you're with students on a. Field trip. Exactly. 

Speaker 1 

Oh my gosh, I love Facebook groups. You can find like your exact niche of people that you that you connect with. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The wearable pump. I mean, that's pretty new in the last like 5 ish years. I feel like it's come to popularity. Did you have a specific brand that you liked? 

Speaker 2 

I can't remember. I think mine was a Willow. It was whatever my insurance covered. Honestly, so your insurance covered the wearable. That's good to. 

Speaker 1 

Know. OK. 

Speaker 2 

So it covered like most of it. You know, insurance would give you a. Like certain amount towards OK certain ones. I think I ended up. Paying like $50.00 for. It but. 

Speaker 1 

Did you still have? 

Speaker 

It was a lot. 

Speaker 1 

The other one from the. 

Speaker 2 

1st baby yes. OK, so some people. 

Speaker 1 

Struggle with the. 

Speaker 2 

Wearable pumps with them not emptying them well enough. So I was really worried about that. But I still had my, like, traditional pump, right. Fun and I would use it if I felt like I was getting engorged or something because I. Was terrified of getting that of. Right. And I didn't have it at all with her. Like 4 times with my. 

Speaker 1 

OK. 

Speaker 2 

First kid and I didn't have to deal with it at all with my second kid, so. I don't know if she was just a much. More efficient feeder. Or what? Or if we just figured out the schedule? Don't know. I don't feel like we really did anything drastically different. Rather than not using the. ****** Shields at all but. Yeah, she was totally different. I was like a major over producer with son, especially with my son. For both oh. So I think maybe my body. Just figured it. Out a little bit better the second time I. Don't know. 

Speaker 1 

But my experience was the opposite, so I didn't get messed with the first one and I did use a ******. Field and then with the second one I got mad cited several times and yeah. 

Speaker 2 

I think. That's crazy. That's it's. Just I don't know. It's like there was. No rhyme or. Reason to it. 

Speaker 1 

Well and but I do so. I'm thinking more and more about. I've heard it's like when your body gets run down, you're much, much more likely. So like the first one you were in pandemic times and like you probably had a constant level of stress like we all did that maybe didn't help anything. And then with your second, you know things were different and maybe just less like a lower baseline. Stress level, I don't know. I'm making that. Up but and like for me having the second kid was more stressful. 

Speaker 

No, that's true. 

Speaker 1 

Like, how do I take care of my toddler and my newborn? I think I didn't allow myself the rest time that maybe I did when I just had the first one. 

Speaker 2 

Yeah, that's something that's a lot more difficult when. You have two kids. 

Speaker 

Everybody's like. 

Speaker 2 

Sleeping baby sleeps. Yeah, that's easy. When you only have. 

Speaker 1 

Yes, yes. And then you, yeah. 

Speaker 2 

I have a 2 year old running around at the same time it doesn't. 

Speaker 1 

Work so well. Yeah, and I remember. It would at one point it was like they. Had complete opposite nap. Schedules were like one would just be falling asleep with the other one just waking. Up so like. You never had time. 

Speaker 2 

Yes, that's how mine worked out too. When the baby was in like 2 naps a day and the toddlers in one nap a day, it was like. Somebody was sleeping. All day, yes, but never at. The same time never. 

Speaker 1 

At the same time. Oh my goodness. It is kind of crazy. Like just the intensity. If you look at your whole life, it's. Really just a short blip of. But when you're in it, it is like just getting. Through the day is. 

Speaker 

Yes, yeah, just like. 

Speaker 2 

Did I shower? I don't know. Probably not. Not, but the kids are alive, so it's all good. 

Speaker 1 

Yeah. Did I eat? I don't remember. If I ate, yeah. Oh, yeah, no, you do bring up the the specific situation of teachers and pumping and I hadn't thought about it ton yet, but I I just, I don't even know when there would be the time. To fit it in. 

Speaker 2 

Yeah, it was hard and I know if you have like a really great administrator that some teachers will have. Like AIDS that will. Come in and watch their classroom for long enough for them to go pump at. Certain times of the day. And like if you can make that work, but right now there's such a shortage of employees in general in the schools, not just teachers, that it's hard to even come up with that extra person. To relieve you. So you have to kind of figure it out with how. It works with your schedule. And and that. Just hard. Yeah, well, whole thing is. Just didn't deal with. It the first time, right and my. Son, I I just knew that it wasn't. Going to work. With the schedule I had and it was gonna be more stress on me than. It was worth. He was already like six months old anyway, so I was like, you know what, if this is the end, if it doesn't work for him to breastfeed part of the day and have formula. The other part of the day. That's OK, I've made it to six months. Know I was happy with that. But it it was fine. He didn't have any troubles which had back and forth between formula and breast milk or bottle and breast. Milk. That's great. It was. It was fine with him. And it worked out well for me. We still got that little bit of bonding, but I didn't have to. Worry about the stress of keeping up with all. The pump parts and well, that's my question. Or not and. 

Speaker 1 

Right. So clearly it was important enough. To you, to. Preserve some of the feeding some of the nursing sessions are out today out the day. So I was going to ask you, like, what do you consider the benefits beyond just like the calories that the baby is getting? 

Speaker 2 

So I just felt like it was. A really good like bonding for us. I loved breastfeeding, even though it hurts like the Dickens in the beginning. And I don't. Matt died is 4 *. I loved breastfeeding them and I loved that like special time together and that I was the only one that could do that, you know, I guess that's a little bit selfish sounding but. No one else could do that for. Him wanted to keep that. 

Speaker 

Well, you're the one that go. 

Speaker 1 

Through the messages too. So it's like the good. 

Speaker 2 

Or the bad, right? Yeah, that. So I wanted to keep that little moment for us in the mornings and in the evenings and at 11 months when he got sick with COVID. That was his first Christmas present to us. He brought it. Home from daycare. When he got sick, he was so congested that he was just done with it. He didn't want to breastfeed anymore because. He couldn't. Really latch well and. Breathe at the. Same time. So that was the end of our journey there. He just gave up. I was like, well, OK. 

Speaker 1 

That's interesting here. 

Speaker 2 

You almost made it to. 

Speaker 1 

Yeah, well, I think a lot of moms want to know, like, what does leaning look like? And it can look many different ways, and that's one example. It's like a life event will happen where it just sort of naturally sort of phases out. So that's that's a helpful example for other people to hear. It was eleven months. You're maybe close anyway, and then the the bean stuffy, he was like keep. Breathing he. 

Speaker 2 

Just gave up. Was like OK. We did have to kind of do a really like mindful weaning process before I went back to school. So I knew that I was only gonna want to pump that one time at a certain time during the day and that we were going to put him on formula when he was at daycare so. About the beginning. Of July, I started working towards that schedule. We introduced formula to him to make sure he. Would take it. We started making Dad give him bottles instead of his mom. To help the daycare. Workers be able to feed him without a major meltdowns. Yeah. And then I also had to work on slowly spreading out the feeding sessions or the pumping sessions so that my body would adjust to feed him at 7:30 and then don't get the pump until 11:30. And then don't see him again until like 4:30. So I had to really slowly and gradually work myself towards that schedule. 

Speaker 1 

MM. 

Speaker 2 

Of course, of about a month. 

Speaker 1 

Yeah, you're right. Because at that point they are still feeding quite often. So I'd like to please you use mindful leaning, but then at 11 months, he was already eating less frequently. Your body was making less. You had already been on. That schedule, so it was less of a big deal. 

Speaker 2 

Yeah, it wasn't really because by then I had already dropped the pumping during the day. At work, my body had just adjusted to that, so we were really only feeding right before bedtime. That was the only, and then he dropped that and. It wasn't a. Big deal. I you know, for a few days had to do a little bit of expressing in the shower or, you know, just kind of relieve that pressure in the evening, but it didn't take much for my body. To to adjust after he kind of. 

Speaker 1 

Gave up? Yeah, no, I think that's a helpful description of kind of like the gentle easing off and the, you know, dropping one feeding at a time, letting your body, I mean, really, really. You're letting your supply sort of readjust to a new norm and then readjust to a new norm. 

Speaker 2 

And I had to be super careful because I had messed by so many times and was so like such an over producer. I had to just drop like one a day and spread them out just a little bit further each day. It was a super slow, meticulous process. Yeah, that's. 

Speaker 1 

Well, I mean, you're a teacher, so you're probably a planner, so. Words from the first day of school, like all right, this is the goal in the first day of school. We're going to work. 

Speaker 2 

In there's like a whole schedule. 

Speaker 1 

Well, that's yeah, it's really helpful for you. To share your experience and. Then with your. Daughter, are you? Did you say you already? Weaned her a few months ago. 

Speaker 2 

Yeah, about around 11 months for her, too. And part of that was I was just done. She she got to where she was, like, clawing and thrashing around. And I didn't. Feel like she was really caring for it anymore. And then finally I was like, I'm just done fighting you. So she didn't give up quite as peacefully as my son. But she told me another way. So she was done. 

Speaker 1 

And was it gradual with her as well, where? You were already down to the. 

Speaker 

Yeah. So. 

Speaker 2 

Yeah, I was only really breastfeeding her in the morning and at night as well cuz I was pumping during the day and we dropped the morning one first and I would keep. Nursing her to sleep at night and then we slowly just kind of dropped that one too and replaced. It with a bottle. Yeah, that works. 

Speaker 1 

I think you said you listened to some of the other spilling the milk episodes. Was there anything that jumped out to you that you that you heard? 

Speaker 2 

Yeah. So I was listening. To one with. I can't remember who you were talking to, but she said that in the shower she got curious if she could still express breast milk. So I was curious too I. Tried it in the bath earlier. And it took like 2 seconds to get. Milk and I haven't breastfed in like 5 months. So it's just kind of. Crazy how long that? Like sticks around. You know I had. Never even thought. To try. That's kind of. 

Speaker 1 

Yeah, I think I had a similar experience in it. It was weird. It was like ohh if I had to feed a baby. Could I do it like, OK like. It is a. I mean, I I remember having the. Thought I was like. What if there's an emergency and there's, like, a hungry baby that isn't even mine, but like? Would I feed the baby? 

Speaker 2 

Yeah, like. Just feed. I think I could. 

Speaker 1 

Yeah. Well, I mean in. Back in the day, maybe in other cultures still there's wet. Nurses like that was their job, yeah. 

Speaker 2 

And then like if you adopt, you know, I've read like you can relax state years later if you adopt or I even read in one culture the the grandmother. 

Speaker 1 

Yeah, sure. 

Speaker 2 

I don't remember what culture this was. Wish I did. The grandmother nurses to help the mom out, so grandmothers will relactation. Years and years later, you know, generation later to feed their grandchild. 

Speaker 1 

Wow. That is so interesting. That would be helpful. 

Speaker 2 

Yeah, I saw that. That was one of the like, random things that was shared in that breastfeeding group when I was, you know, breastfeeding at 2:00 o'clock in the morning. It's like, oh, if only my. Mom could do. 

Speaker 1 

That yes, because that is the hard part. It's like it's all on you. You are the only one to do it. 

Speaker 2 

Yeah, I thought that was crazy. Like I didn't know that was, you know, physically possible. But I guess it is. 

Speaker 1 

Women are amazing at all stages of life. Well, is there anything that we didn't cover or any advice you have for maybe moms who are pregnant and they're about to breastfeed for the first time, like what would? You love to tell them. 

Speaker 2 

Just stick with it like it is hard in the beginning. If you really want to do it though, you know, stick with it, give it a couple of weeks for your body to adjust, but it hurts in the beginning and I don't feel like anybody told me. Like everybody talks about, you know, it's all rainbows and sunshines and it's so healthy for your baby and it's wonderful bonding experience. And that's all true. But nobody warned me. That it was. Gonna hurt and that my nipples were gonna be cracked and dry. And I'd have to use nipple butter and. You know all this stuff like. Nobody tells you that. But stick with it. But also like. Advocate for yourself if something's not going right. You know you trust your instincts, because if it's hurting too much, something's probably wrong, you know. The latch isn't right or the baby is tongue tied. Or there's so many things that. Could be going wrong, so advocate for yourself. And get help if you need that help. And kind of on that topic, but a little, uh, not related to breastfeeding, but I had a lot of trouble. You know, having intercourse afterwards too. I had a lot of pain in that area and ended up having to go through pelvic floor therapy, but waited way too long. To get help. For that I mean I it was like 6 or seven months postpartum before I even went to my OBGYN. And it was. Like, hey, this hurts. Something's not right, you know. And pelvic floor therapy helped. Dramatically and relatively quickly, and I'm like, why? Didn't I do this sooner? 

Speaker 1 

Was that covered? Rain chance? 

Speaker 2 

That's just as. It was, yeah, it was all covered. So that was. Just another one of those things I didn't know. Nobody ever talked about that. Just thought it was normal. But no, it wasn't normal to not be able to have any sort of intercourse six or seven months later. That was just another one of those things nobody ever mentioned. Nobody ever told me. I had no idea. And so I just kind of kept it to myself. And of course it was also during COVID. So extra doctor's appointments weren't. 

Speaker 

Right. 

Speaker 2 

The top of everybody's list and. 

Speaker 1 

That's so true. No, I think even appropriate point it's not talked, it's probably talked about even less than breastfeeding, but I remember learning that in France, most women postpartum like as routine go to pelvic floor therapy like it is for by insurance and it's just part of their culture. And here it's like pretty rare or just nobody talks. About it. 

Speaker 2 

I had never even heard of it until like I finally went to my doctor six or seven months later. She's like, oh, you probably should try this. What does? That does that mean? Yeah. 

Speaker 

Yeah, I feel like. 

Speaker 2 

It should just be a part of. Our postpartum like routine. Body has gone through such major changes that we we go to physical therapy for every other like, you know, minor surgery or problem or whatever. 

Speaker 1 

Oh my gosh. Yeah. 

Speaker 2 

Like why not do it? For childbirth too, I don't know. 

Speaker 1 

Yeah, that's a great point. Well, thank you. That's great advice for new moms. Thank you so much for chatting with me today. And for sharing your experience. 

Speaker 2 

No problem. Thank you for having me. 

Speaker 1 

I would like to thank Courtney for being my guest today. I appreciate her being open and honest and vulnerable and giving us a peek into her experience. In our conversation, we touched on the importance of pelvic floor health and pelvic floor therapy and how that might even be talked about less than breastfeeding. And an exciting news, my next episode of the podcast is going to focus specifically on this issue, and we're going to do a deep dive with an expert on the topic, so I cannot wait for that. Please subscribe and check back in for that episode coming up soon. In the meantime, I invite you to go to empoweredbumpsandboobs.com and subscribe to our newsletter to stay up to date on all the happenings on the podcast and with our Breastfeeding boot camp that launches very soon. Thank you so much for listening. And if you know of someone who might also enjoy these conversations, please share the podcast with them. Please leave us a review so other people can find us on their favorite podcast app and be well.